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tower of light

April 2017

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uh-huh, soi fong, ......

和Iris吐槽《Kingsman》

鸢尾:这么多人都喜欢Kingsman…………
蝴蝶:是啊好像就我们两个感觉一般般2333
鸢尾:G说有人喜欢Kingsman让他doubt humanity……
蝴蝶:他为啥不喜欢?因为开头中东那段?唔中东人不喜欢英国挺正常的。
鸢尾:就觉得情节烂吧。我从酒吧里喝啤酒就……
蝴蝶:情节是挺烂。各种“你逗我呢”。
鸢尾:那个“我今天心情不好请让我喝完这杯酒”那种,太桥段了……
鸢尾:okok this pretentious bastard is going to kick their sorry asses....
蝴蝶:片头那群人不是被Harry狂揍吗,为什么到了片尾还在找打……都不长进吗
鸢尾:因为是配角……
蝴蝶:不记打吗,那么魔幻的一幕
鸢尾:我没看到最后……囧
鸢尾:反正看着让我觉得,我对美国文化真是深深认同。英国这群装13的……
蝴蝶:最后就是,Eggsy穿着西装去酒吧找他妈,和妈妈说买了新房子可以接她走。他妈BF不愿意,胁迫他妈不许走
鸢尾:就是太脸谱了嘛
蝴蝶:一来二去就杠上了,Eggsy就完全模仿Harry一开头那一段揍了他们……
蝴蝶:什么关门啊,伞柄酒杯啊,一模一样
蝴蝶:也说了manner maketh the man
蝴蝶:我的注意点就再在于,为啥那群人还敢惹他……
鸢尾:配角……囧
鸢尾:我就觉得,你不就是上了一个social class么……
蝴蝶:不过人家装是因为人家能装。美国想装也装不出,所以算了
蝴蝶:就像日本的话说说华族,说说神社祭祀,还像那回事,韩国华族什么的你听了不笑死吗。
鸢尾:我觉得怎么说如果是好莱坞美国片,那这个穷小伙会以穷小伙的方式来救人。这个家伙给我一种"Now I'm one of them! I'm out of Here!"的感觉
鸢尾:那你身后的贫民窟呢!
蝴蝶:但是你不觉得,恰好这种思维很符合美国方式吗?
蝴蝶:出人头地,(理论上的)social mobility。英国的槽点恰好是没有social mobility。这小伙子能穿西装其实是证明的美国价值观啊。
鸢尾:但是美国主流片到最后都有个"I'm still one of the poor.... being poor gave me what I have and made me who I am, thus saving the world....."
蝴蝶:是吗……《了不起的盖茨比》呢……
鸢尾:他死了啊!悲剧了啊!
蝴蝶:死得其所(喂)
鸢尾:哈哈哈哈。反正Kingsman一排白男,我就……
蝴蝶:这个倒是可以理解呢。因为设定上来说,基本都是传统贵族的子女来应征。传统贵族就都是白人啊,虽然这个设定本身我就很orz
蝴蝶:Chester那种人,怎么可能来……(这片子不遗余力黑Chester,也是够粗暴的……)
鸢尾:They ain't even trying
蝴蝶:不过可以理解的其实,我说casting。
蝴蝶:你和我说Lancelot是黑人,就像被悲惨世界这次百老汇revival的安灼拉是黑人,我出戏啊
鸢尾:那不一样嘛。搞个Kingsman的小角色是黑人,也不是太破坏剧情。问题是小角色也木有
蝴蝶:就像007如果黑人演员来演,我也感觉很奇怪,老实说
蝴蝶:这些都是symbol,而且还是关系到race和nation的symbol,而且还有specific time stamp
蝴蝶:就像唐朝也有胡人吧,你演一个电视剧,说杨玉环是胡女,看被喷死不……
鸢尾:嗯我知道,但是给一个小角色,哪怕是哪些受训的 或者Kingsman里开门的
蝴蝶:开门的就算了……开门岂不更加坐实了……
鸢尾:你跟我说他们都是黑人确实不靠谱,但是看到全白的,我也觉得非常不舒服
蝴蝶:事实上就是,他要反应的那个阶层,就是全白的啊
蝴蝶:你看英国那些贵族有几个不是白的?反正我是一个都想不起来
蝴蝶:像TH拍的亨5,里面有贵族是黑人,我都觉得违和呢……
鸢尾:但是片子说是推崇gentleman
蝴蝶:那是那个阶级的口号你还当真吗- - 他们坏事少干了吗(不是说他们比别人更坏就是了)
鸢尾:Well that's the point they ain't even trying
蝴蝶:真要说,可以让那个气象学家是个非白人
鸢尾:那些学员也不是非要都是白的嘛
蝴蝶:然后也被白人男主淘汰了……怎么没感觉好很多的样子
鸢尾:那不可能更好了啊……除非你叫Jaden Smith去演主角……
蝴蝶:所以我不知道你在纠结啥……
蝴蝶:受众葱白的英国,所谓的大不列颠情怀,就是那个白得牛奶一样的帝国
蝴蝶:君不见留美论坛上一天到晚都有人说老墨老黑生太多,美国要完,一个道理嘛
鸢尾:所以我不喜欢啊。因为我以为,他们想表达,在现代,绅士风度骑士精神是跨越性别和社会阶层的
鸢尾:但是他们不是这个意思,所以我……摊手
蝴蝶:我觉得他们就是卖情怀的……
鸢尾:不过可能我比较中二吧……还有那么多人觉得宫崎骏的风起了好看呢……
蝴蝶:呃,我觉得就是敏感啦。各人的经历决定了我们会有不同的敏感点。
鸢尾:嗯,我觉得可能还是对这种社会阶级带来的所谓优越感有点……
鸢尾:当然情节烂也是事实
鸢尾:就好像可能有人觉得民国时期大小姐用什么法国瑞士进口的东西多有格调……我就会觉得我擦民脂民膏……
蝴蝶:看到章诒和的《往事并不如烟》某些地方我也有那种感觉
鸢尾:嗯,那种钱堆起来何不食肉糜,被有些人认为是身份高贵的象征,有着无穷超越世俗的魅力。
鸢尾:我就很想说,一点也不超越世俗。就是……很多钱,而且够长久。
蝴蝶:没办法啊,绝大部分人都挺庸俗嘛,包括我
蝴蝶:金字塔NB吧,死了多少人……
鸢尾:不能跟你连续俩天讨论人生……
蝴蝶:是的,我也有这个感叹……
鸢尾:……
蝴蝶:真的啊!很多艺术品,特别是建筑什么的
鸢尾:是的啊,肯定啊
蝴蝶:但我看到还是会觉得好棒啊好棒啊好棒啊
蝴蝶:这就像说起穿越,貌似都觉得自己能穿越回中上阶层……
鸢尾:怎么说呢,我觉得It is amazing, but in the back of my mind, I am not only amazed by the architect itself, but by humanity, what we were capable of
蝴蝶:没人觉得自己会穿越到窑子里……
鸢尾:是啊,我不会啊……
鸢尾:我总觉得穿过去很快就会死的
鸢尾:带着和那个时代格格不入的……免疫系统……(太不浪漫
蝴蝶:没有网和辣椒的时代是不可取的

Comments

Reminds me of the story about Visconti shooting The Leopard. He had a lady as consultant to help his actors to act more like the nobility. And when one of the actors asks how long does it take for someone to truly act like the nobles, the lady said, three generations...

It's an old story that you've probably heard, but your conversation reminded me of it.
Yes, the "Three Generations" rule is widely discussed in China (with the rise of the 3rd Red Generation and the nouveau riche). For me, personally, it's not about what they wear/eat/drink but what they do with their money and influence.
Have you read Watching the English by Kate Fox? Fascinating look at the class differences in England.

I've read 章诒和's《往事并不如烟》too. I don't think the upper class is merely propped up by long-lasting money. There's a certain attitude and mindset to it, and hopefully, noblesse largesse is part of that mindset. I don't know if that offsets the fact that the government officials were living on taxpayers' money and corruption.

Edited at 2015-05-19 03:01 pm (UTC)
Re: Watching the English--No I haven't. Thanks for the rec! :D

Looking back, I think I judged《往事并不如烟》too harshly. People are, after all, products of their upbringings and times. I think my discomfort mainly comes from the fact that with 20/20 hindsight, I am placing some of my misgivings with the current "民主党派人士" on their predecessors' shoulders—namely that they have became co-opted by the very system that they are supposed to critique. Of course, with history, it soon becomes a question of chicken and egg—did oppression come first or selling out?